Input consistency & heavy car bug – Rocket Science #19

Input consistency & heavy car bug – Rocket Science #19

Hey guys, HalfwayDead here with another episode
of Rocket Science. In this one, we’re going to explain input
consistency, run experiments, discuss how to optimize it, and show how the experiments
could be used to test heavy car bug. Let’s get this topic started. Why would you or anyone care about the topic
of input consistency? Let me illustrate this with this simple example:
My car is positioned a short distance away from the ball, standing still. I want to get a powerful shot, so I will accelerate
with boost, jump, tilt back, and dodge forward. There is an optimal timing of all the steps
in this routine which will maximize the power of the shot. Finding the correct approach shall be a topic
of a future video. However, what I want to discuss here are the
things, that can get in the way of executing this shot perfectly, even if you know how
to do it. The most obvious and, one would hope, the
biggest influencer of the execution is the human. Even when knowing how to hit a powerful shot,
any human can easily mess up the corrects timings by a couple 1/100ths of a second. But it isn’t the only culprit in this equation. The input device can also make a difference. I’ve already mentioned this in my controller
input lag test and I’ll further elaborate on the testing scenarios later but a device
with only 100Hz polling can cause a deviation of up to 10 ms. And regarding wireless controllers, I have
previously measured up to 20 ms deviations due to wireless interference or weak signal
strength. And lastly, we also have the game. Now to set the record straight, Rocket League
physics are deterministic. That means, if the same inputs get used in
the same physics step, the outcome will be identical every time you repeat the same inputs. There are still reasons for why that timing
could get messed up though, even if the human and input device have done their job perfectly. The game only checks the state of the inputs
every frame, but the physics run at an independent rate, which can create alignment inconsistencies. The same kind of alignment can also happen
if the framerate is not in sync with the polling rate of the input device. I’ll explain that later. Let’s get back to the human aspect. As always, I didn’t want to just state the
obvious, that humans are not perfect. I wanted data. I wasn’t able to find quite what I wanted
online so I set up my own experiment. I opened up and wired up my mouse to connect
it to my Arduino. A necessary step, to make sure the machine
error of the measurement is basically 0. What I did then, was to turn a metronome to
120 BPM and tapped along with the beat, measuring the times between each button press. The expected time is 500 ms and that was pretty
much exactly my average. The interesting part, however, is obviously
the consistency. In this case, the standard deviation. It was just below 15 ms in my case. A short note here: While I have played the
piano since I was 5, and would expect myself to be above average at this kind of exercise,
I didn’t feel like I was able to replicate the same consistency that I can when playing
a piece of music. Therefore, I think that this is not the human
limit of timing accuracy, but it is a data point to start with, and I was also interested
in confirming whether the average timing fits a normal distribution, and it does. But how does the polling rate tie into this? To figure that out, I can take the measurements
and treat them as if they were made at a lower polling rate. The result seems rather uninteresting at first
sight. Even with a polling rate of 100 Hz, which
is the lowest of any common controller that I’m aware off, the inconsistency only increases
by 0.3 ms or 1.8% compared to 1000 Hz. That is a good sign and makes sense if you
consider that some professionals are using the DS3 at the highest level of play, but
I also said that 100 Hz polling could screw you over by almost 10 ms and that is still
true. Let’s say you pressed the button 501 ms after
the previous press and you barely missed the polling window of the controller. As a result, your input will be sent after
510 ms, making it 9 ms worse than it was. But, and that’s a big but, the exact same
thing can also make your input 9 ms better if you pressed the button too early after
491 ms. In the end, this effect will save you as much
as it will screw you over, but the average inconsistency only goes up slightly because
the options are more extreme. It should be noted that if you go as low as
50 Hz or even lower, the inconsistencies will start to get significant quite quickly. In the same sense, someone with better timing
accuracy than me might be limited by 100 Hz polling already. Earlier, I said that there are other technical
reasons for why inputs might be inconsistent. Those are best shown by going over the entire
input process from the button press to physics. In this example, we’re going to assume that
we wanted and managed to press down a button for exactly 50 ms. Our controller shall have a polling rate of
250 Hz, so it polls every 4 ms. 50 ms / 4 ms=12.5, it doesn’t divide. We can only have a 48 ms or 52 ms button press. Which scenario happens, is decided by the
timing of the button press within the 4 ms window. We can assume those micro timing alignments
to be random. In this case a 50/50 chance for either scenario. Then we have the game, running at a stable
144 FPS. The game checks the inputs every frame, so
it’s going to check every 6.94 ms. 48 ms / 6.94 ms=6.91. Which gives 91% chance for the input to last
7 frames and a 9% chance to last 6 frames. In the 52 ms input case, it could last either
7 or 8 frames. The physics in Rocket League, however, get
calculated independently of the framerate with 120 ticks a second. Apply the same kind of math we did it in the
last step and you get the end result. There are 3 scenarios. Either the game calculates the physics as
if you pressed the button for 5 ticks, approximately 42 ms, 6 ticks, 50 ms, or 7 ticks, 58 ms. The odds of registering the intended 50 ms
are only 67% and the other two scenarios are 16% each. Had we capped the framerate at 120 FPS instead,
having it at exactly the same rate as the physics, we would have a 76% chance for exactly
50 ms. Any multiple of the physics tick rate will
outperform any other framerate in terms of consistency. This may sound more dramatic than it is until
you calculate that with my inconsistency data earlier, I would only be able to hit the perfect
tick 22% of the time. The example was also assuming perfectly stable
framerate which is unlikely. So far, we have seen why achieving 100% consistent
inputs is basically impossible. But can we actually measure these effects
in a test and see how it affects gameplay. A theory means nothing unless it holds up
in an experiment. This is the part which took me the longest
to make. You might think it’s easy, just create a macro
with any gaming software and run it over and over again. Sadly, it’s not. The accuracy of these ranges from completely
inconsistent to usable in some tests. Unfortunately, when the whole purpose of the
experiment is to measure consistency, then slight inconsistencies are already unacceptable. So I went back to my trusted Arduino. It has a microcontroller that allows me to
connect it to the PC just like any real gamepad. The only difference is, that I am free to
program it exactly how I want. So I got to work and wrote some code that
allows me to not only to run macros on the Arduino but also simulate polling rates and
other inaccuracies. Then, I set up the shot from the initial example
I gave at the beginning of the video. To ensure maximum baseline consistency; I
took a couple of steps. Rocket Labs map, lowest graphics settings,
closed down every program I didn’t need, and maximum performance mode in Windows, so the
processor doesn’t use it’s power saving features. I also locked the framerate to 240, a multiple
of the physics tickrate, that I was able to reach in a very stable manner. Then I let the experiment run for as much
time as was feasible. For the baseline experiment that was almost
6000 shots which takes over 4 hours. The results are better than I expected to
be quite honest. The default shot I set up was 3041.75 uu/s
and it happened 91% of the time. Within the entire test, not a single shot
was below 3008 uu/s and not a single one above 3062 uu/s. That’s a difference of less than 2 km/h or
barely over 1 mph. Still rather uninteresting on its own so let’s
go on to the comparisons. First, I varied the polling rate default 1000
Hz, 250 Hz, 125 Hz, and 100 Hz. The percentage of perfectly consistent macros
is 91%, 67%, 47%, and 26% respectively. In the macro, there are obviously multiple
actions that have to be done at exactly the correct timing relative to each other. So those 26 % are most definitely better than
the 22% human quota I said earlier. The worst case shot strength for all polling
rates below 1000 Hz was also an additional km/h lower. In my controller input lag test, I measured
that, despite the lower average input lag of the DS4 in wireless mode, the input consistency
was a little worse. Other wireless controllers tended to have
a slightly lower consistency too. With the latency distribution data I collected
back then, I can now simulate what using a wireless DS4 would be like with my Arduino. The result is kinda interesting, but it makes
sense. The amount of times the perfect frame timing
is hit is 78%, as opposed to the 67% in the 250 Hz wired case. However, that is not the full story, which
I think is best shown in visual. Most of the time, the higher polling rate
saves the controller and makes it more consistent, but wireless is never 100% stable and you
can get these spikes which have bigger impacts on actual gameplay than the polling rate will
ever have. I’d personally rather have small inconsistencies
often, than bigger inconsistencies rarely, but you can make an argument to justify either
cable or wireless. What else can we test? Well obviously framerate. I’ve made a big deal out of matching the framerate
with physics, so I have to back that claim up. I tested a couple of framerates but for the
main comparison I went with 144 since it’s bigger than 120 and one that people commonly
use. To make sure this doesn’t just come down to
a bit of randomness, the experiment was also run for over 4000 shots. The amount of perfectly consistent shots went
down to 68% instead of 91%. But, I hear you say, isn’t that just the lower
framerate in general? It is not. With 120 FPS the result was the same again
as 240. In fact, a tiny bit better but that is likely
just down to randomness because I didn’t test it as long. I also unlocked the framerate completely,
causing the framerates to go up to around 600-800. As framerates approach infinity, the theory
predicts that the syncing starts getting irrelevant, but I was still able to measure a 5% drop
in consistency here. More concerning are the results that happen
below 120 FPS. At 60 FPS the intended shot happened exactly
0 times, and there is a good explanation for that. If I wanted to start boosting, and then stop
boosting 9 physics ticks later, that is literally impossible. Since the game only checks the inputs every
frame, all actions will last an even amount of physics ticks. That means the intended macro cannot be executed
perfectly. In a sense, the 60 FPS case was still consistent,
because there were basically only 2 different results that happened a combined 95% of the
time. Those 2 results have a speed difference of
4 km/h though, which makes that gap bigger than any of the worst results that happened
at higher framerates. Because of that, you’ll always want as high
of a framerate as you can get if you can’t get at least 120. These results are interesting but in real
situations, you’re probably not going to get that stable of a framerate. The reason I did most of the tests this way
is that introducing inconsistencies will also make the experiment results more random. Regardless, I did want to check whether any
of this is relevant when the framerate isn’t as stable. So I did test exactly that, by putting a Twitch
livestream and a youtube video on my second monitor, left all my usual apps like Spotify
and Discord open, and put the graphics settings to the maximum. The frame graph looked like this. So, very inconsistent but it does still hit
the capped framerate quite a bit. Obviously, if you never reach the capped framerate
then the cap is irrelevant. So I did this with 240 and 144 FPS, and the
results are quite clear. The perfect shot with 240 unstable FPS happened
slightly more often than with stable 144 FPS. Unstable 144 FPS was 30% worse. Stable 144 FPS is of course still better than
unstable 240 FPS, because getting a big stutter will really screw you over. That wasn’t the point of this experiment though. So all I had left to do, is try it myself. I got the intended shot, you guessed it, 0
times in 500 tries. Obviously, I can’t imitate a macro, but we
can once again look at the visuals to see something interesting. First, let’s go with the best case scenario
I had. This shows, that if RL is running as well
as it can, you should never blame the game for missing. The 144 FPS unstable experiment had some major
stutters from time to time, and those can be just as bad as your own whiffs. Personally, I thought the 60 FPS stable experiment
was most interesting though. If you line up my good shots with those results,
you’ll see that if you just take my good shots, they vary no more, if not less. That would explain why no one who has played
120+FPS likes going back down. There are just these shots, where you felt
like you did well, but it doesn’t go exactly as expected. But I’m probably starting to interpret a bit
too much here to call it science. Feel free to draw your own conclusions. TL;DW. What can you do to get the maximum consistency? First: Get the best PC you can, so you have
enough horsepower to run the game at a stable high framerate. Second: Get an input device with the highest
possible polling rate that is wired, if feasible. Third: Cap your framerate at 120 or 240 FPS. The latter will have a little lower input
lag, but it’s basically irrelevant for consistency. Fourth: Optimize graphics settings and power
options to tweak performance. Is your framerate stable? Congratulations, you have done all you could
and now you don’t have any excuses left when you miss the ball, Whoops. This leaves another question open though. Is there anything Psyonix could do? Since the physics aren’t tied to framerate,
there are indeed options. I got Bakkes to write me a piece of code that
would read the inputs directly to the physics ticks, skipping visual frames. My all so smart idea turned out really stupid
when I found out that the physics ticks, are always queued relative to visual frames and
therefore calculated at irregular intervals, even though they act as if they are calculated
at regular intervals. Ergo, the result is identical. There is a still a possibility to get more
consistency through an input buffer. I’m not gonna explain in detail what it is,
but it would increase input lag in order to improve consistency. I might try that out in a future video if
people are interested and ask players to test it in freeplay to see if they like it. Psyonix tends not to experiment and give us
too many options, so I don’t have the highest hopes of ever seeing it in the game. If you’re only here because of heavy car bug
and you still watched all the way, then I applaud you for trying to understand everything
I talked about so far. I shall make a short explanation of what I
understand as heavy car bug and how this video relates to it. Quite a long time ago, some players started
to complain about Rocket League on Reddit and the official forums, stating that the
control of their car felt inconsistent, shots felt weak, and or their cars were outright
turning or moving slower. Moreover, a distinction that I like to make,
although I think some people are split on this, is that the bug only happens sometimes
or it only happens on a specific account. If you don’t have anything to compare to,
after all, there is no way for you to know if the inconsistencies you’re feeling are
out of the ordinary or even your own fault. So with that out of the way, here is the problem. No one has been able to reliably reproduce
this change in game behaviour and it’s supposedly independent of such proven inconsistency factors
as unstable framerates. There have been a large number of suggestions
on possible causes of the symptoms as well as fixes in the past, but for some, it never
seems to go away. First, I want to get into some of the causes. Very often, I have heard that the physics
actually change when hcb happens. That is essentially impossible in online games. The server and your computer calculate the
physics independently and if your cars turning radius on your computer was wrong then the
server would send a different location and you’d get moved to the correct location. I could also talk about how I test the physics
every patch to make sure they stay the same, but that is obviously only proof that it is
that way for me. But there is a heavy car bug Discord where
many affected people have been doing a lot of tests with the help of some Psyonix developers,
and as far as I’ve understood it, they have ruled out actual physics changes. Another suggestion is input lag. Delayed inputs can feel horrible and I myself
would never like running on a TV with high input lag. The problem with this suggestion is, that
you can obviously have high input lag, but that it isn’t necessarily Rocket Leagues fault. I have already made lots of videos, explaining
and measuring different causes of input lag. Once again the people in the testing Discord
have already been trying to measure the input lag Rocket League causes through code. If you’re still suspicious, my external testing
setup could be reproduced with about $40-$50 which would allow testing your input lag and
confirming that it stays constant. So if it’s neither the physics nor the input
lag, then it must be that inputs are not reaching the correct physics ticks. For which I suggest using a setup such as
the one I had in this video. If the macros can get consistent inputs but
you can’t, it must be your fault. If the data shows anything suspicious, then
you have something to work with that might help fix the issue. So my suggestion is, that you can contact
me and I will help you order and setup these tests on your own computer if you want to. I do hope, that if there are a lot of people,
I can refer you to those that have already done it, so you can help each other. Before you go and contact me, I want you to
seriously consider that, because it will be some work and the setup isn’t completely free. I personally do think it’s either a visual
bug or a placebo. I’m not just gonna state that though. I’m going to give you 2 completely free experiments
to do right now, that might convince you. First one is just an anecdote to counter some
of the heavy car bug related statements I’ve heard. In the workshop map called “The Wall” there
is a tight turn at the very beginning of level 4. It is possible to get through that turn without
powerslide while boosting from the start. Though, if you try for the first time you’ll
likely fail. The only way to do it is to pre-steer before
you can see where you’re going. Why am I showing you this? I think I’ve heard the statement “See how
quick squishys car moves? My car is always slower.” one too many times. The top players are able to make turns and
twists just in time because they have already given the input way before you think about
it. When a player lands perfectly on the wall
after they’ve flipped into the ball, it is because they have done the right inputs before
their flip was even over. Enough about that, the more interesting experiment
is the second one. It’s pretty simple, just go into an exhibition
match with the slow-mo mutator and play that for 30 minutes straight. Alternatively, you can use BakkesMod to create
slow-mo in freeplay. When you go back to normal speed after playing
slow-mo for that long, you’re gonna feel like it’s way too fast. It’s a great example of a placebo fooling
your brain into thinking something is too fast or too slow. And you’re not immune to this because you
have x thousand hours. I hope no one who thinks the bug is real takes
this personally. I don’t have proof that it isn’t, but I could
never prove that unless I tested all the computers all the time. Please, do not take this as an insult. It doesn’t matter who you are, our minds can
be fooled. Science has never accepted a feeling as proof
and I will not believe that this is a real bug until I have seen evidence that shows
it. Before I inevitably cause too many dislikes,
I shall end it. Shoutout to my patrons who continue to support
me financially. Without them, videos like this one would be
impossible. If you want to join the supporters for as
little as $1 you get a vote on topic priority and a guaranteed reply to your questions. If you want to stay up-to-date about RL changes
and the channel, follow me on twitter, or join my discord, and I’ll see you soon for
the next video.

100 thoughts on “Input consistency & heavy car bug – Rocket Science #19”

  1. If you do want to contact me, pls do it through Discord The macro can be changed to do anything btw… Doesn't have to be a shot.
    There is a TL;DW for the first part at 16:42 but it doesn't explain anything, just gives you a checklist of what you can do to optimize the consistency.
    I talk specifically about heavy car bug after 18:31 but I do recommend watching everything if you feel like your inputs are inconsistent.

    This video went through many revisions. Ended up a bit long, but I hope it explains the topic well.

  2. You put A LOT of effort into this video, and all your previous videos. And we thank you for that <3 Quality information / content as usual 🙂

  3. Another Placebo that can fool your brain is how alert your brain is. I've noticed on a consistent and reproducible manner that if I listen to music (or any audio really) right after I wake up that it seems about 20% faster I would guess. Enough to make a song feel different and to make me second guess myself.
    Because I can't connect an arduino to my brain I doubt it's possble to really test this. But given how reliable the phenomenon occurs if I test after waking up I'd say its a real example of placebo or another body chemistry element affecting perception of identical events.

    Either that or every computer I've used is fucking with me.

  4. Hi, I've played a lot with V-sync on in the past and even reached C1 with it a long time ago and when I learned about the fact that it causes input lag and turned it off, I could really feel the difference and thus I've learned a lot about how does having input lag feels. Months later, I've "experienced" (as it may not be real) the heavy car bug and it really felt like playing with V-Sync on again eventhough I checked it and it was still off. It doesn't happen all the time and it's really random but it definitly last an entire game, it can go on and off between each game on the same server tho. I know that's not science at all but I'm pretty sure that there's definitly something going on with the game and it's not some kind of placebo effect like the scarab feeling different from the octane or some kind of illusion like the ball curving in game. Also, it has become less noticable since I've optimized my game to have the lowest input lag I can get but I do have some games where I feel like there's some input lag and then it goes back to normal.

  5. Is it possible to override the polling rate of USB controllers and force them to 1000hz? This used to be a common thing for gaming mice.

  6. when i play rocket league:🤤

    when halfwaydead play rocket league:

    v̅ = Δs
    Δt a̅ = Δv Δt dv t v = v0 + at s = s0 + v0t + ½at2v2 = v02 + 2a(s − s0) v̅ = ½(v + v0) ∑F = ma ∑F
    fs ≤ μsN
    fk = μkN ac = v2 ac = − ω2r J = F̅Δt J = ⌠F dF̅Δt = mΔvF dt = Δp Δs cos θ
    ⌠F · dsF̅Δs cos θ = ΔE F · ds = ΔEK = ½mv2 K = p2F · ds
    F = − ∇U ΔUg = mgΔh η = P̅ = ΔW P = dWP = Fv cos θ P = F · v ω̅ = Δθ
    Δtω =dθv = ω × r α̅ = ΔωΔtα = dω
    a = α × r − ω2 r ω = ω0 + αtθ = θ0 + ω0t + ½αt2
    ω2 = ω02 + 2α(θ − θ0)ω̅ = ½ (ω + ω0) τ = rF sin θ τ = r × F ∑τ = Iα
    ∑τ = dLI = ∑mr2 I =⌠ r2 dmW = τ̅ΔθW = ⌠⌡ τ · dθτω cos θ P = τ · ω K = ½Iω2 L = mrv sin θ
    L = r × p
    L = Iω H = τ̅Δt H = ⌠m. τ̅Δt = mΔω ⌠⌡ τ dt = ΔLFg = − Gm1m2 r̂
    g = − Gm r̂ r2 Ug = − Gm1m2Vg = − Gm
    v = √Gm v = √2GmF = − kΔx Us = ½kΔx2T = 2π √ mT = 2π √ ℓω = 2πf P = P0 + ρgh B = ρg
    q̅m =∆m ∆tqm = dmq̅V = ∆V
    ρ1A1v1 = ρ2A2v2 A1v1 = A2v2 P1 + ρgy1 + ½ρv12 = P2 + ρgy2 + ½ρv22 F̅η ΔvxA Δz
    ηR = ½ρCAv2 η √gℓ F = E ΔℓAℓ0
    σ = F = G Δx τ = Gγ F = K ΔV P = Κθ ℓ Δℓ = αℓ0ΔTΔA = 2αA0ΔT ΔV = 3αV0ΔT ΔV = βV0ΔT Q = mcΔT
    − mv2
    p(v) = 4v2 m 3/22k √π 2kT vp = √ 2kT m ⟨v⟩ = √ 8kTπmvrms = √ 3kTm
    P̅ = ΔQΔtP = dQP = kAΔTℓP = εσA (T4 − T04) λmax = bTΔU = nRΔT ΔU =
    NkΔT W = − ⌠⌡ P dVΔU = Q + W ΔS = ΔQv = fλ ∆s(x,t) = ∆s sin
    ⎡2π ft − x⎤λ∆P ∆P0nλ = d sin θ nλ ≈ x
    n1 sin θ1 = n2 sin θ2 sin θc = n2 q1q2 r2 F = 1 q1q2 r̂
    4πε0 r2
    ΔV = ΔUE q E̅ = ∆V d E = −∇V − ⌠⌡ E · dr = ∆V
    E = k ∑ q r̂
    r2 E = k ⌠⌡ dq r̂ r2 V = k ∑ q r V = k ⌠⌡ dq
    rκε0A2πκε0ℓln(b/a)4πκε0 QV 2 I̅ = Δq Δt dq Rs = ∑Ri = ∑ 1
    Cp = ∑Ci FB = qvB sin θ FB = qv × B = IℓB sin θ dFB = I dℓ × B B = μ0I ⌠
    B = μ0I 2πr FB = μ0 I1I2 ℓ 2π r ΦE = θ ΦE = ⌠ ΦB = θ ΦB = ⌠ ℰ = Bℓv ℰ̅ = −
    ΔΦB Δt ℰ = − dΦB ε0 ∇ · E = ρ ε0 ∯B = 0 ∮E · ds = − ∂ΦB
    ∇ × E = − ∂B ∂t ∮B · ds = μ0ε0 ∂ΦE + μ0I ∂t ∇ × B = μ0ε0 ∂E + μ0 J E (x,t) = E0 sin [2π(ft −
    x+ φ)] ĵ λ B (x,t) = B0 sin [2π(ft − x + φ)] k̂ λ t' = γ ℓ' = ℓ√(1 − v2/c2)
    ℓ' = ℓγ u' = u + v 1 + uv/c2 E = mc2 √(1 − v2/c2) E = γmc2
    p = mv
    √ (1 − v2/c2) p = γmv E2 = p2c2 + m2c4 E = mc2
    √(1 − v2/c2) K = (γ − 1)mc2 λ = f0 = √ 1 + v/c

    λ0 f 1 − v/c E = hf E = pc p = h λ p = E
    c = E − ϕ Kmax = h(f − f0) iℏ ∂ Ψ(r,t) = − ℏ2 ∇2Ψ(r,t) + V(r)Ψ(r,t)
    ∂t 2m Eψ(r) = − ℏ2 ∇2ψ(r) + V(r)ψ(r)
    ΔpxΔx ≥ ℏ
    ΔEΔt ≥ ℏ 1 = −R∞ 1 − 1 λ n2n02 h= N02−t/T½

  7. i know this heavy car bug, it's really frustrating. For me personally this bug only occurs when i'm either very hungy/tired/depressed(all the good stuff). i really don't think it's the games fault by any mean, but when you are not feeling well, the whole game feels different. That's at least my experience with this bug. Can anyone relate?

  8. Yes, sure im interested in further research, and can you test latency on new switch controllers? Pro and HORIPAD? ty

  9. This video is amazing 🙂 Incredibly interesting. I don't even play Rocket League anymore, these videos are just super intriguing to me. This one might be your best one yet imo! Keep it up!

  10. I respect your knowledge but you are missing the point on hcb and you are being somewhat insulting to people with hcb. All you have to do is visit an area with hcb and you will know what hcb is and that it is possibly caused by dropped or delayed packets on certain routers, which you don’t experience in your area. Suggesting it a could be placebo and offering idiotic ways to get over it is not science.

  11. I've watched your previous videos and followed that G-Sync Input Lag guide you mentioned (G-SYNC 101: Input Lag & Test Methodology on a site called blurbusters) and set my framerate to 117 on my 120hz G-Sync monitor and it's been pretty great for a while now. But now this video has me confused. Would the input lag benefits I already gain from having my framerate capped to 117 outweigh the benefits I'd get from setting it back to 120 to match the physics? Also, I was under the impression that V-Sync automatically turned on if the framerate matched the monitor's hz when using G-Sync and doesn't that introduce even more lag? My guess is that I'd have to disable both G-Sync and V-Sync and set my fps limiter from 117 back to 120 to see the benefits mentioned in this video. Uhhh….you don't possibly have time to run another day-long test at 117fps limiter/120hz monitor do you? 😉 Anyway, the work you're doing is incredible. Much appreciated. I just wish I knew……I have that G-Sync Input Lag guide telling me 117 fps limit on my 120hz monitor for lowest input lag. But with the 120 polling rate of Rocket League physics, does that just get thrown out the window?

  12. Psyonix has some problem most likely with uninitialized variables and something tied to individual accounts. For a long time my free training would start with the ball half way to the ceiling, but only on 2 out of 3 accounts (2 PS4, 1 Mac/Steam). Interestingly the two accounts that showed the bug had the same account name (one on PS4 and one on Mac/Steam). Recently (a few months back) this no longer happens, but did happen for at least 5 or 6 releases before that.

    Second, my camera shake was invisibly turned on in a recent release (it showed as off, but it was on). Toggling on, and then returning to settings and turn off again worked to fix this (once fixed always fixed for this bug).

  13. You never cease to blow me away with your videos! I completely agree with you on heavy car bug. The fact that no one has been able to put forth any strong evidence in the past few years that the game has been out speaks for itself. The game won't just randomly slow down, especially because of the authoritative servers like you mentioned.

  14. If you've never felt it, you wouldn't be able to explain it, you can basically go from, winning 6-0, 5 games in a row, to not being able to hit the ball a single time like it's your first day playing, the difference is huge. I refuse to believe that it's just mental and an inconsistency in my play. You can unbelievably see and feel it in the power in which you hit shots, and the speed your car is moving. air dribbles go from easy peasy instinct, to absolute impossible, same with winning kick offs. Sometimes changing controllers and resetting the internet will help, however it usually only lasts a few games. If it's not monitor/input lag related, then it's certainty something to do with the ISP or network. Interesting how when the server goes down for an update, the game has played near perfect for me in free play. It happens on both pc and ps4, where on PS4 the specs etc have little impact, as i have a 1ms monitor and wired controller.

  15. I had a bad heavy car bug, i took apart my ds4, popped ioen the green tabs on the joystick, stole the white copper contacts from the right joystick and switched them with the left and my heavy car bug disappeared. When i tested my joystick before by putting deadzone to 0 and driving straight it veered left slightly. Controllers are the one thing everyone uses and everyone abuses over time. So give it a go if its your last option.

  16. Dude u deserve so much more sub.
    I Don't know if people actually realize the huge background work u do to make a video like that !
    Btw i change my PC and i still have it :

    Older PC : GTX960/ 4GbRam/ I5-7400 / Asus Mobo/ 1 HDD 1 To/
    New PC: GTX1060 6GB / 16GB 3000Mhz / AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.85Ghz/ MSI Mobo / 1 SSD and 1 HDD

    My Monitor: Benq X2411Z 144hz
    Internet : Cat6 Ethernet Cable 1GB/s

    I have the HCB and i dont dislike =)

    Also i already find alot of fix but they work like 2or 3 days and after the feeling come back again…
    Example : Change Steam Accoount/Computer Account
    Uninstalling Realtek Audio device and using the default Microsoft One.
    Changing my audio frequency 16bit44110hz to 16bit 192000hz and 24bit44110hz to 192000hz
    i notice a difference between these frequence. ( Restarting the game evry time i change the frequence in the parameters 3hours)
    Switch To MICROSOFT PRO version cuz i was on the Home change nothing.
    Port Forwarding Steam and RL ports. ( did nothing …)
    Set to False the OneFrameThreadLag ( work pretty well at the start and the feeling comeback again..)
    and other and other and other examples..

    Tbh if it was really a mental or a placebo effect, one of these changes would not have changed my sense of heaviness even once.
    Sorry for my english im french..

    I have more than 5K hours in this game playing since 2015 ( not a beta player) current MMR 1700-1800 ( Grand Champion already top 100 in 1s )

  17. How would the consistency be if you were to cap the framerate with rivatuner at 120 or 240 fps? (Capping the framerate with rivatuner at x fps results in perfect 1/x s frametimes provided nothing is holding back the framerate to lower than x.)

  18. What does he mean in number 3 (Cap framerate at 120 or 240)? I have xbox one controller and a 144 hz monitor, should I put my monitor on 120 fps? or only the games fps on 120? Or should I put my games fps at 240? Not good to use 250?

  19. I haven’t tested this properly but whenever I’m streaming I get the heavy car feeling, even though my game runs at 250fps it feels very sluggish. I don’t get it when I’m not streaming..

  20. Very informative, great work! I sometimes do experience the heavy car bug, but I believe it to be my deadzone shape resetting to default from square when I switch between accounts and the controller needs to register again. Normally restarting my PC fixes it though. It's very noticeable when it happens though as my muscle memory has fully set in with 1000's of hours played at a high rank.

  21. Would you ever make a video on how ps4 has bad input lag compared to pc? I really hope psyonix add an high performance option on consoles

  22. What about 180fps? I play at 1440p and can't achieve 240, but don't want to drop to 120. 180 is in the realm of possibility

  23. Would it have to be exactly 240 fps? How much of an impact a couple frames off would have? Even with a good computer and fps capped at a lower value, online games regularly drop 1-2 frames; so with fps capped at 240, a good amount of the game would really be played at 239 or 238 fps.
    Also, you tested with unlimited fps which are by essence very unstable but what would the results be at a higher capped fps like 300?

  24. Like many others know, it isn't placebo. When you turn on VSync and switch it off again, HCB is gone for about 1-2 seconds. When HCB occurs, why can I set Aerial & Steering sensitivity to 10.0 without any difference? Why do I need the handbrake for every turn when HCB occurs? I shouldn't be able to handle the car with 10.0 sensitivity! When HCB does NOT occur, it's freaking fast with 1.0 sensitivity and I never need handbrake.
    inb4 OS problem: i'm an IT technician and tested every OS, all with the same result.
    inb4 weak PC: I7-8700K, 16 GB DDR4-2400, GTX 1080, 240 Hz Monitor
    inb4 try other accounts: i got 55 steam accounts, 6 with rocket league, no differences

    thank you for your attention

  25. Have you ever tried testing macros on different servers at different hours of the day/night? What i usually feel as heavy car bug is input lag/framedrops and other cars not moving fluidly/weird physics behavior during online games, never in freeplay or a server where im the only one playing. This is usually during times when lots of people are connected to the servers or steam, at 5am in the morning no online server gives me any problem.

  26. I was going to say that human Input shouldn't be "0-50" because no human is capable of 0, but then I remembered Kuxir97.

  27. when i set my fps limit to 240 vs having it at 160 (i have a 165Hz monitor with g-sync) jumping and then immediately dodging feels very inconsistent and slow. (ie: sometimes causes me to not dodge at all) do you know what would cause this?

  28. Don't put heavy car bug in the title and then the only solution you give is that it is a placebo effect if I wanted that I would have watched every other video on it. I expect an actual solution and causes from you not play in slo-mo.

  29. I use ds4, while not touching right stick my view changes like 1 degree every second back and forth. What would be the problem?

  30. nice video! i own ps4 an pc rocket league, and i notice that i play much more consistent on ps4. when i play on pc it its like there is a slight input lag. i barely hit the ball how i would hit him on ps4, also my kickoffs feeel super laggy, 50s aswell. its no more 50/50s but more like 80/20. (winning just 20% of my ''50s'' and kickoffs)

  31. Would like to hear someone use this as an excuse for playing bad. Not like it's lag or a 20fps experience, these things are next to irrelevant, you just suck ass at the game, get good.

  32. So based on what you're saying even though my monitor caps at 144 I should still run the max frames in game @ 250fps to increase the amount of times the game checks for input? Or does it not matter because my monitor caps @ 144?

  33. lol ive always thought squishys videos looked slow, not just him, but the whole video, but i think its because im used to looking at the game at 144 fps, and the videos he posts are at 60 fps and its just a mind trick, its not any slower, but im used to seeing more information per second at greater detail.

  34. 22:56 no way I can prove that but after 3000 hours I can feel the difference between my car control.. ofc Squishy learned car control over the years but trust me if I say there are differences between car control speed after my first and my fifth game, and what about if I restart my game then I feel it faster, so the question/problem still unanswered. I asked pro freestylers about hcb and I heard the same story again and again with the same stuff I experienced too

  35. For anyone saying wondering about the heavy car bug. Couple more things to note:
    Did you change anything in your setup? PC/Console, screen or controller?
    If any of these checks, there's your problem. Your input lag has changed, slightly.
    I noticed when playing on my xbox. On pc, everything is perfectly fine. On xbox, my car feels slow and the inputs feel heavy. There are 2 reasons for that. First, framerate. Like talked about in the video, 60fps creates inconsistency in input. Another problem is screen input lag. I know, that my pc screen has around 4-5ms input lag, while my tv has 32ms.
    Technically, that is a really small change for a human, but it still affects my gameplay. I can't really see any difference, but the car feels… different in RL.
    Only way for me to notice the increased input lag, is when playing on consoles before lcd and led tvs. Best example probably is playing Blaster Master on NES.
    I have played through the game waaay too many times, and i have started to learn to speedrun it. On CRT tv, no problem, i can go through the game perfectly fine, in a decent time. But on my Hd tv, with the said 32ms lag, i can't even beat the game. I am able to see, that my inputs are late, but theres nothing i can do for it. I have always played it on CRT tv, and i cannot learn to play it with any input lag. This is probably one cause for the heavy car bug too.

  36. HCB this HCB that… Is it really that hard to swallow that humans are inconsistent by default and that rocket league is a game, and games need to be restarted some times. Hell, even the computer needs a restart/cool down, no matter how well the FPS is saying the game is running.


    I'm sorry.

  37. Ooh, I shall drop my FPS to 120 I think, I don't think I can get 240 without making the game less pretty. And it's not like I am actually any good to really matter. Cheers for the massive brain.

  38. I watched 100's of RL replays to make a video. To get through them quicker, I often played them at fast speeds. Afterwards, I couldn't play the game anymore, because my brain got so used to that speed. I can attest to what you talk about in the video, even when talking about watching me play vs me actually playing

  39. I think there is a really good piece of information regarding framerates that aren't multiples of 60 fps. Especially for myself when running dual monitors. I notice that I have video glitches and problems running 144hz on the main, and 72 hz on the secondary. I had more issues with my 144hz when the secondary was running at 60hz, and I have more issues with the secondary while running video at 72hz. Any graphical animations that had to be drawn on the secondary while playing rocket league on the 144hz would cause huge frame drops. Even something simple like my CPU temp monitor changing numbers in the task bar, or someone's name lighting up in discord would cause big draws on the RL frame rate. So based on what I saw in the video, I am now running my primary monitor at 120hz (because the difference is nearly impossible to see without a reference) and the secondary at 60hz. What I know about programming tells me that most programs are likely designed to be running at 60hz and running anything higher will cause more issues. I also have locked RL at 240hz even though the monitor runs at half the frame rate. I think I will be getting the best results, as even playing around in training, I experienced less frame drops than I normally would. The framerate rarely deviated 2-4 fps, where normally it would be dropping 5-40 fps.

  40. Well, I've read on reddit that a DS4 connected with bluetooth has less input lag than a wired. So I got myself a bluetooth adapter. It runs fine so far. In your video at first I see the same image as on reddit and it says bluetooth is better. But later you say I should get a wired controller. Could you explain it in a simple way, so I can understand it? And btw: Any advice for the polling rate with a DS4? I assume it's at 250 Hz. Thx

  41. What about phantom ace steam controller check box? That affected his other rocket league account and it cause the heavy car bug!

  42. HCB,
    There will be a day when I hit the ball or even touch it , it will be powerful touch and turning will be faster and then there will be a day when it feels so slow in turning , has happened multiple occasions

  43. When does shit developers fix this? Are they totally braindead or? This shit bug has present for many years now and they dont do anything. GJ

  44. The first time I tried RL online on Linux my car was horribly misbehaving. It wasn't just heavy, but it actually sled across the floor slightly as if I held down drift, but in a more minor form because it wasn't actually drifting, just sliding slightly. I don't know if this has anything to do with the actual physics calculations or if it was what others describe as the heavy car bug, but it's more than proof to me that there is something fishy going on with RL. Maybe it has something to do with connection quality, but it could be anything, really.

    I think I could say it felt like the triggers were not being registered as moving up as quickly as I let go of them, causing the car to keep moving when it shouldn't, which in turn would feel like the sliding effect. But again, that's only a guess. I could not figure out what was going on.

  45. I've been suffering from heavy car bug since last week, it just happen in online matches, the difference from the training mode is very noticeable is almost like the octane turns into a road hog

  46. It made me very sad that (actual) ping was never even mentioned. All of this stuff sounds great, but nobody I know of has ever had of HCB playing offline. @rocket_science have you indulged looking into ping inconsistencies? My HCB goes like this. I'm on west coast. I play west coast servers, but i generally get between 50-80 ping depending on the server. (numbers are lower since they changed what is calculated), but I never have more than 22 ping in any other game with west servers. There is One server – USW3 – assorted names that I will get that 22 ping, and NO HCB. No HCB in freeplay/exhibition. However, in every other west server, It is mainly noticable with thumbsticks. I can literally have my thumbstick held one direction all the way and just jump. every time i land. i am at a different angle . every time. FUll jump button holds. However, on USW3, It is perfect everytime. I brought the same computer with me to new york last month and played on east servers. most of the time never got more than 7 to 12 ping, and no HCB. Once i got a (farther away, maybe) server. HCB is back with a vengance. turns are never the same radius. aireal movements are a shot in the dark.

    What is your take on this?

  47. I was experiencing HCB without actually knowing it had a term. It turned out that my controller (xb1) was just dying. Button presses were not being registered properly and sometimes the analog stick would not respond immediately, the controller was a few years old. The minute I got a new controller (I'm using a ds4 wired now), HCB disappeared completely.

  48. This video helped me a lot, I was running my game at 245 fps but i always felt something was wrong after this i lowered it to 120, since no matter what I did I got a little bit of frame drop at 240(like 5 frames but it was noticeable), the difference is visible, and my gameplay got better since now I feel confident when going for ball reads, big big thank you.

  49. Is it possible to fasten the game, so we can play for some hours, and then go back to the normal-speed version?

    It would be some great trainning imo

  50. I used to change my camera settings alot, and that's what I blame the most in the game.

    I had the feeling that the physics engine was changing as I was changing my camera settings, althought that would be an absurd thing. It really was just a feeling.

    I can't quite find the settings that are the most comfortable for me. I change them alot, ranging from:
    fov: 110
    distance: 220
    angle: -12
    swftness: 1.00

    to something like:
    fov: 105
    distance: 290
    angle: -3
    swiftness: 0.30

    Also, the position of my real and concrete monitor from me is super important for my gameplay.

    I used to play on a smaller monitor before, but then I got a new and bigger one, which actually affected my gameplay too. I couldn't get used to it for a while, but I'm starting to feel comfortable now.

    I can remember at somepoint in my "career" (oof, that sounds so weird to say… I have 2000+ hours though, so I guess I can safely say it's a career? When can we even say it's a career though? Idk, who cares) that I felt that my car was varying in weight. I'm pretty sure it's at least partly due to the factors I just mentionned. There are these small, tiny visual factors that affects greatly my gameplay, and I'd be surprised if I was alone with this.

  51. thank you for making these videos. you definitely deserve more recognition and appreciation for what you do, but I'm glad you're a part of the RL community

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